HREOC Website: Isma - Listen: National
consultations on eliminating prejudice against Arab and Muslim Australias
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|| Meeting Notes: 27 May 2003
Muslim Lawyers’ Group
at Richard Griffiths Library, Melbourne, 27 May 2003
The meeting was attended
by Susanna Iuliano and Omeima Sukkarieh from HREOC and by 7 invited participants
from the Muslim Lawyers’ Group. The group is an informal social
network (formed in late 2002) of Muslim lawyers practising in Melbourne.
1. What are your experiences
of discrimination and vilification?
General
Participants were
in agreement that there has been a general rise in the level of discrimination
and vilification of Australian Muslims after 11 September 2001. While
there was consensus that discrimination and vilification has risen, the
group stressed that not all Australian Muslims have been equally affected
– Muslim women have borne the brunt of it, particularly women who
wear the hijab.
“I think
there is no doubt that after September 11 there has been a rise in terms
of the perception that you are a danger. From a woman’s perspective,
if you wear the veil then you are seen as a fundamentalist – you
are a danger.”“You
feel that you are always being scrutinised by people around you –
it’s not an overwhelming thing – sometimes it’s very
subtle in terms of people’s way of dealing with you. I think that
it’s more from ignorance rather than from an attempt to put you
down or discriminate against you.”
There was also a
general perception that the public reaction to Muslim Australians following
the recent Gulf War in Iraq had been calmer compared with the earlier
reaction to 11 September 2001 and the Bali bombings in October 2002.
“After
September 11, the community was in a state of fear – you walked
down the street and everyone was pointing fingers looking suspiciously.
After this Gulf War, the community was braced again for these kinds
of actions - but personally, and from what I’ve heard from speaking
to other people, it hasn’t been that bad because in the intervening
period there has been a lot of discussion about how not every Muslim
is a terrorist and about ‘what is Islam’. The awareness
is growing slowly – very slowly.”
At work
All participants
had legal qualifications and were working in a professional capacity as
barristers, solicitors or consultants in private practice or for government.
Several participants reported having experienced some form of direct discrimination
in employment. However, the more common experience was indirect or subtle
prejudice which arose from ignorance or uncertainty about Islam rather
than outright racism from employers and colleagues. Participants agreed
that professional workplaces were not immune from discrimination or prejudice,
particularly when it came to hiring practices. There was consensus that
Muslim women wearing the hijab face particular difficulties in obtaining
employment in a professional law firm.
“15 years
ago there was an article in the Melbourne Age about Muslim women and
discrimination in employment. At this point, it seems as though it’s
far worse than better – I think we’ve gone backwards.”
“They
would never employ you in a commercial law firm with the hijab…
I’ve actually had people tell me, ‘You take that (hijab)
off and you can come’… In job interviews, I’ve had
questions asked like ‘Does your husband let you work?’ or
‘Do you have children?’.”“I went
for an interview with one of the big national law firms and the woman
[interviewing me] was floored. She literally spent the first few minutes
reintroducing herself she was so shocked… a woman wearing hijab
is the last person they expected to come walking through the door.”
“S”’s
story encapsulates many of the issues faced by Muslim women in the professional
workplace. In both of her last two jobs with commercial law firms, “S”
gained employment without the hijab. “I didn’t wear the
veil when I first started in the profession. I always wanted to, but for
a number of reasons I couldn’t. Then after finishing my articles
I really wanted to put it on.” Rather than suddenly appearing
at work wearing the veil, she tried to gradually introduce her employer
to the idea in a relaxed, informal setting. At a weekend work retreat,
she asked a senior partner in her firm, “What would you think
if I came one day putting on the veil?”. The partner choked
on his food, gave her a blank look and after a few seconds said ‘What
about the clients? What are they going to think?’”. “S”
laughed off the response but later quit and moved to another firm. “I
really wanted to wear the veil and I knew there was no future for me there
if I wore the veil.”
“S” also
began her next job without wearing the veil and again gradually introduced
her new employer to the idea once she had become more established in her
position. To allay concerns from the firm’s partners, she took a
photograph of herself veiled and gave it to one of the partners for consultation
with the other partners. She was told, “Look, I can’t
really say anything. You can go ahead and put it on if you like and see
what happens.” When “S” began wearing the veil
at work, the firm’s partners were initially uncertain about how
clients would react and limited her direct contact with clients. This
changed after a few months when the partners relaxed and “S”
had more client contact. While some of the other consultation participants
were outraged that “S” needed to seek permission to wear the
hijab, she felt that the whole experience had been a positive one and
she stayed with that firm for three years.
“Most
people are just ignorant about it - they don’t know how to react.
The image that they have in their minds [of a woman in hijab] is just
totally negative. When I prepared them for it I found it a really positive
experience – they felt like they were part of the whole thing
rather than just being forced to accept it.”
She also emphasised
that Muslim women were not the only group whose progress in the legal
profession was affected by appearances. She argued that other young lawyers
who were perceived as different because of their culture or sexuality
also faced difficulty gaining an initial foothold in the profession as
firms were not prepared to invest in a person whose difference could pose
a risk.
“Because
you’re different, and it doesn’t matter what your difference
is, - it’s not just being Muslim, its whether you look Middle
Eastern, of if you have one eye – getting through the door is
very very difficult. Many people do take off their scarves because of
that.” However, “S” argued that the situation
improves once given a chance to prove yourself professionally. “I
have no problem going out and applying for a job now with my scarf –
I am being headhunted because I am skilled in intellectual property.”
Like “S”,
many of the consultation participants felt that while individual employers
could be open-minded or tolerant, their fear or uncertainty about employing
Muslims (particularly women wearing the hijab) was driven by their own
perceptions of broader racism and discrimination amongst their clients.
“Even
if they think, ‘Well I’m open-minded’, there is a
concern at the back of their minds that, ‘Oh my clients are going
to run out the door terrified…”“I had
a conversation with one of my managers once and he said ‘Look
it doesn’t matter what I think, we have to react to the market.
The market is not ready for this…”
One female consultation
participant felt that this broader negative perception would only change
over time as more Muslim women gained employment in professional positions
and became more visible in offices and workplaces. She relayed how a recent
trip to England, “was like going through a time warp and seeing
what Australia could be like in 20 or 30 years. Sisters in hijab are so
common there, every single professional office you walk into - they are
there – they’re solicitors, doctors, teachers etc.”
In addition to talking
about difficulties acquiring employment for ‘visible’ Muslims
such as women who wear the hijab, consultation participants also described
how more subtle misunderstandings can impact on work relations and capacity
for promotion. For example, one of the male participants described the
difficulties that can arise in relation to leave requests. During Ramadan,
he requested two days leave on either side of Eid several months in advance
from his employer, a major consulting firm. However, his employer had
scheduled a major client presentation on those days and he was placed
in a difficult position of having to choose whether to go home to celebrate
Eid with his family or stay at work and do the client presentation. He
did the client presentation but subsequently the firm took steps to ensure
that he didn’t have to make such a difficult choice again. “It
was an instance where they had never encountered that kind of situation
before. Now that it has happened, they’re aware of it and they’re
beginning to manage that. Maybe that’s the only way to resolve these
experiences.”
Overcoming barriers
to networking and building social connections with colleagues was another
big issue raised in the context of workplace relations. The fact that
many work functions are often held in pubs was seen not just as a social
barrier, but as a barrier to professional advancement by many participants
because of the perception that they may be missing out on networking opportunities
at social gatherings.
“Work
functions are normally drinks on a Friday evening. I still feel queasy
about attending – sometimes you have to because you need to get
to know people…”“When
you’re at court or on circuit the only way you get to know the
magistrates or judges and other lawyers is to go out drinking with them.
When I first started work I remember them saying to me, ‘You don’t
drink, you don’t eat this meat, you don’t swear –
you won’t get to know anyone…”
In public spaces
While the focus of
the consultation was mostly on employment issues, several participants
such as “S” relayed how they or their family members felt
uncomfortable or threatened in public spaces such as on the street and
in parks.
“Just
yesterday for example my mum and brother were walking on the street
and someone threw eggs out of a car at them.”
One participant told
how fear and suspicion interrupted a simple picnic in the park for about
thirty Muslim families during last years Eid celebrations. During the
celebrations, a group of mothers and children who were playing games in
a quiet section of the park were approached by a friendly ‘group
of white people’ who came over and asked what the families were
doing.
“Suddenly
all the mothers were in a huddle whispering ‘they’re from
ASIO – they’re here to check up on us’. In half an
hour we were all out of there. It was ridiculous…One Muslim is
bad enough – but in a pack it spells trouble. We get viewed with
suspicion.”
Fear of investigation
by the Australian Secret Intelligence Organisation (ASIO) or the Australian
Federal Police was a common complaint. One young lawyer explained how
she was working with a Sh’ia Mosque in Melbourne (whose members
were mostly Iraqi) to help them set up a charity account to send money
to Iraq for the construction of a hospital. The local Imam pulled out
of the initiative for fear of raising suspicion with the Australian Federal
Police who he feared would confuse their attempts to raise money for a
hospital in Iraq with channelling funds to terrorist organisations in
Iraq.
“When
you can’t do a simple thing like collecting money for a good cause
– which is a fundamental basis of any type of religious organisation
– it just shows there is a big problem much deeper than simple
prejudices...”
Aside from instances
of direct or indirect discrimination because of religion or race, one
of the participants relayed an incident where she felt hurt because of
assumptions about her class made on the basis of her religion. After going
to an expensive restaurant for a special night out with her husband, “S”
was insulted when told to check the menus before dining in the restaurant.
She felt that the waiter was insinuating that the restaurant would be
too expensive for her because she was Muslim. In the lift leaving the
restaurant, the waiter said, “see I knew it wouldn’t be
appropriate for you, it’s too expensive.” She felt hurt
that the waiter had made an assumption about her status and ability to
pay based on the fact she was Muslim. “I just was just shaking
at that moment…I didn’t know how to react. We just walked
out – but it ruined the whole evening – you just feel really
put down.”
Criminal justice system
The experiences of
discrimination faced by young Muslim men in the police and criminal justice
system was the particular concern of two young solicitors whose work with
Legal Aid and the Aboriginal Legal Service brought them into contact with
young Muslim defendants.
“Of course
Muslims and Arabs are targeted…Police are ready to charge Muslims
immediately – in civil disputes, in anything…Guys get abused,
they get called ‘terrorists’ and ‘Bin-Ladens’
by the police. I’ve actually heard of police prosecutors beating
Muslims with the Yellow Pages calling them ‘you terrorists’.
Admittedly, many of our clients do plead guilty – but still that’s
not the kind of treatment they’re entitled to…”“Many
Muslim clients have their children taken away under supervision orders.
Clients tell us all the time about the treatment they get from police
and I see it. The police do nothing about it…”“The
differences in Australian law and Islamic law, especially in domestic
issues, is a big problem and is creating a lot of issues…”
Local government
The issue of obtaining
local government approval for mosques and prayer rooms surfaced throughout
the consultation. One participant described a situation in the eastern
region where an application to build a mosque was eventually approved
by a local Council in Eastern Melbourne despite concerns from local residents
who criticised the Council for its actions. The issue of serving halal
food at Council functions was also raised in the context of the media
‘storm in a teacup’ over the actions by the Hume City Council
in banning pork from Council functions.
Other
The issue of asylum
seekers was raised briefly during the consultation by one participant
who felt that there needed to be more parliamentary debate about the issue.
She was also critical of the Prime Minister’s portrayal of asylum
seekers as ‘illegals’ which she felt was feeding hostility
and prejudice amongst the general public and affecting people’s
reactions to her personally. “I’m Iraqi and people look
at you as someone who is an intruder; as someone who has no right to be
an Australian or be in Australia…”
2. What is being done to fight
anti-Arab and anti-Muslim prejudice and discrimination?
Muslim Lawyers Group
The formation of
the Muslim Lawyers Group is a small but positive initiative. The group
is a loose affiliation of legal professionals practicing or qualified
to practice in Melbourne. An effort was made to form a similar group at
the end of the last Gulf War which had been unsuccessful. The group began
meeting in 2002 to discuss a range of issues relating to discrimination
and vilification. ‘K’, who formed the group, was encouraged
to bring Muslim lawyers together in a discussion group after confronting
elements of discrimination and vilification in the course of his work
as a barrister.
At an informal level,
many of the members of the group were actively challenging stereotypes
about Muslims and ignorance about Islam by clearly identifying themselves
as Muslims in professional contexts. For example, group members mentioned
that seeing their colleague “S” (who wears the hijab) publish
her photograph alongside her articles in legal journals helped challenge
people’s misconceptions about Muslim women. Other non-veiled participants
spoke out to identify themselves as Muslims and challenge prejudice or
ignorance.
“I don’t
wear any distinct cultural markers like the hijab which identify me
as a Muslim – but after September 11 in the course of dealings
with friends or acquaintances, I let them know I am a Muslim. I don’t
drop it into every conversation, but I do mention it if it might provide
some insight into something like the Hume Council affair.”“I was
at children’s court one day and a prosecutor said to a kid with
an Arabic name ‘Oh are you related to Bin-Laden?’ I said
to the prosecutor, “Excuse me – I am a Muslim, does that
mean we’re all terrorists?”
Government strategies and
projects
Complaint
hotlines
The passage of the
Victorian Racial and Religious Tolerance Act in 2001 was noted by members
of the Islamic community in Melbourne who received information about it
through their local mosques at Friday prayer. After September 11, Islamic
religious leaders brought people’s attention to the anti-discrimination
law. They also publicised the complaints hotline which was set up in the
wake of September 11 by the Islamic Council of Victoria. One participant
explained that the general reluctance for people to come forward and complain
to this hotline was fear of further discrimination.
“If you
have a personal incident happen, the general tendency is that you want
to put it behind you. Pursuing it can increase the discrimination.”
Anti-discrimination
law
Several of the participants
felt that the current anti-discrimination law in Victoria had an important
symbolic value, but could not be used effectively to deal with the media
or institutionalised racism among police
“The
law in Victoria doesn’t cover institutionalised racism…there
aren’t enough consequences. Even when the Islamic Council of Victoria
tried to use the racial vilification laws against the Herald Sun newspaper
– the defence is always freedom of speech.”
Most participants
felt that the complexity of the complaints process discouraged people
from coming forward.
“As practicing
lawyers, we hate to make complaints because we know what it involves
– it’s alienating to me…We advise our clients of the
nature and complex process of complaints and they get put off –
it’s too difficult.”
3. What more could be done
to fight anti-Arab and anti-Muslim prejudice and discrimination?
The meeting proposed
the following strategies for achieving the six objectives identified by
Isma.
Promoting positive
public awareness
Breaking down prejudice
through education was a key issue that surfaced repeatedly throughout
the consultation. Ignorance rather than malicious racism was seen as the
cause of most prejudice and discrimination therefore addressing the broader
public’s ignorance about Islam was a seen as a major challenge.
At an individual level, many of the participants were already actively
challenging stereotypes about Muslims and ignorance about Islam.
Cross-cultural training
At an institutional
level, participants felt that more effective cross-cultural training,
particularly for police, was crucial. One participant explained that Muslims
are hesitant to go to police because of cultural differences.
“Even
when there are problems in the community, people tend to try and solve
it in-house by going to the Imam or going elsewhere - that can have
another negative impact especially in domestic situations.”
Building bridges
between the police and Muslim communities was seen as vitally important.
One participant suggested creating designated Muslim liaison officers
in the same way there are designated Koori Liaison Officers in police
forces. Participants also questioned whether police currently receive
any cross-cultural or diversity training and whether this training had
any particular focus on understanding Muslim or Arab Australians. Participants
argued that if police aren’t already offered it, this training should
be a compulsory part of a police officer’s continual professional
development. They also suggested that the training itself should be more
than a lecture or a pamphlet but should include interaction with young
people from the communities they police.
“They
need to know the people they are policing. There is no point in having
an organisation leader or lecturer come and speak because they aren’t
going to run into him on the street – it’s the actual kids
that they are going to be working with they need to speak with.”
Media portrayals
One participant felt
strongly that Muslims need to be shown on television in order to be considered
part of Australian society. The only time Muslims are shown on Australian
television is when they are cast as villains or victims. There is no recognition
of the diversity and complexity of Muslim communities in Australia on
Australian television.
“We need
to be seen as part of Australia – I don’t think we’re
seen…You watch Australian television and it’s like Muslims
are not part of society at all. Take Neighbours for example –
have there been any Muslims on Neighbours?”
Challenging vilification,
discrimination and stereotypes
The group thought
that Muslim professionals have an important role to play in dispelling
myths about Islam and felt it was important for Muslims to identify themselves
as Muslims in a professional context. Consultation participants believed
that an effective way to confront people’s prejudices is to show
that Muslims occupy a diverse range of positions in Australian society.
“There
are Muslims in all sectors of society – that is somewhat lost
in the perception of rape gangs in Sydney or issues like that which
become part of the public image of Muslims.”“If one
person can break down a barrier slowly, that helps. You need a few role
models or examples…”
Legal remedies
Participants argued
that the law was of limited value in challenging vilification. One participant
recalled how during passage of the Victorian Racial and Religious Vilification
Act the press were anxious that the law would impact on their freedom
of speech. However, one participant pointed out that the ‘experience
has proved otherwise’ with the exemptions for free speech imposing
significant barriers for complainants.
“People
have to be moved and organised enough – it’s not something
that can be done lightly at the drop of a hat…. It’s a bit
like defamation laws – it’s only the rich in the end who
can use them to protect their reputations…”
Providing community support
Community capacity building
“Muslims
don’t know how to get resources.”
Participants agreed
that Muslim community organisations, including Islamic schools, are under-resourced
and that Muslim organisations have to push for more funding. Opinion was
split as to whether government should make its grant processes more accessible
to Muslims or whether it was up to community groups to fight for funding.
Several participants pointed out the difficulty of applying for funding
without any resources to start with. In relation to funding applications,
the issue of religious versus ethnic identity surfaced. One participant
pointed out that Muslim organisations often apply for grants on the basis
of being a women’s group or ethnic group because of the perception
that they will not get funds on the basis of their religion. Groups have
learned to emphasise racial or ethnic grounds over religious identification.
“Even though organisations are often a combination of religious
plus ethnic groupings, the broader community finds it hard to understand
the umbrella identification of ‘Muslim’... it may be hard
to get funds if they are thought of doing it for missionary or evangelical
purposes.”
Strengthening relationships
between and within communities
One participant stressed
that much work needed to be done within Muslim communities to increase
trust and communication. It was also up to communities to look beyond
their own organisations and pro-actively engage with and educate other
groups in society.
“The
Muslim community should look internally and see what their strengths
are and focus on their strengths and disseminate knowledge and awareness
among themselves.”
Informing communities
about their rights
Providing information
about complaints in appropriate languages (for example Turkish and Arabic)
and informing people about their rights through appropriate channels such
as through mosques or Muslim radio was seen as vital to a successful public
information campaign.
“ A lot
of first generation Muslims, their English isn’t that great and
they don’t know the processes (to complain) or feel comfortable
with them…”
Ensuring complaints are taken
seriously
Most participants
were sceptical about the effectiveness of complaints processes although
all acknowledged that anti-discrimination laws and complaints processes
have an intrinsic symbolic value. All participants identified police as
key players in ensuring that complaints are taken seriously.
“You
can have legislation but someone has got to enforce it and the mechanisms
for enforcing are through the police so they become a very important
factor in all of this…[However] people are hesitant to go to the
police – there is an access to justice issue. ”
The effectiveness
of current complaint systems in relation to policing was questioned by
several of the participants. While the Police Ombudsman offers some recourse
for Muslims who face discrimination by police, the Ombudsman was seen
as ineffective in providing justice in individual cases. Protecting the
identity of complainants was seen as particularly problematic.
“The
simple fact is we don’t even recommend most of our clients put
in complaints because they then become marked by the cops…We have
all these mechanisms to complain – but what do we do to protect
our clients from being further harassed and marked, especially when
it comes to the police? Who polices the police?”
Complaints relating
to discrimination in the workplace were also seen as problematic.
“No one is going to be stupid enough to say ‘I’m not
going to give you the job because you’re Muslim.” While
the difficulty of making complaints was acknowledged by all participants,
they also recognised that complaints generate statistics which can be
used to direct policies that may bring about positive change. If these
statistics are not available due to paucity of complaints, one participant
suggested that more careful monitoring of statistics in situations like
employment may help to identify the broad trends in discrimination –
particularly in hiring practices.
Participants were
aware of the discrepancy between federal anti-discrimination law and the
Victorian state law in its coverage – or rather lack of coverage
– of religion as a ground for discrimination and vilification. While
participants were sceptical that legislative change to the federal Racial
Discrimination Act would be effective in eliminating prejudice against
Muslim Australians, all agreed that changing the law would send an important
symbolic message and would have spin-off benefits in terms of its educative
value. If the push for legislative change was to progress, participants
cautioned of the need to construct the debate with utmost care to avoid
further recrimination against Muslim communities.
“If people
think that changes to the law are being brought about purely for the
benefit of Muslims then they’ll see it as another change caused
by outsiders coming in…it might actually get hard for the Muslim
community.”
One participant suggested
that the way to avoid any backlash against Muslims was to construct a
debate about the need for legislative change including other religious
groups such as Sikhs and Jews.
“If you
make it a group effort on behalf of all religious groups then surely
it will be ok. We have to show how it’s affecting a large part
of the community – not just Muslims.”
Other issues and suggestions
One of the other
participants suggested that affirmative action policies for Muslims may
help overcome barriers to employment. This suggestion was seen as unrealistic
by most other participants, one of whom argued that affirmative action
policies would be humiliating for individuals who are held up as ‘token’
figures in professional workplaces.
